Love you guys…
Posted on October 26, 2006
Filed Under Uncategorized
UPDATE!
Wow. I just keep pissing people off… LOL. I open my email just now (1745) to a boatload of email of pissed off screenwriters who don’t think you should ever pay for an analyst.
Since I really don’t have the time to answer all the email:
First of all, REREAD the post. I never said EVERYONE SHOULD HIRE AN ANALYST. Second, read the comments and my reply to Laura. Geez. I really get under your skin, HUH?
GOOD.
Third, here’s an alternative to hiring an analyst:
A Screenwriter Shoots His Own Unproduced Scripts, With a Gun
Here’s the guy’s site: TOM BENEDEK
One last thing for you screenwriters in the U.K. — Clive from over at $1000 Film says that U.K. based writers qualify for FREE Professional script notes/reports from their local Arts Council Film section.
Amazing.
Love you guys… LOL.
Unk
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12 Responses to “Love you guys…”
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You didn’t piss me off, Unk ;) I think you’re great.
It sounds like you’ve been around long enough, and have had enough success to be worthy of honest feedback by your peers. What we’re talking about here is people who don’t have that kind of support.
When I was first starting out and learning to write, I stumbled upon an online romance-writing community where hopefuls and authors met to discuss writing. It took five years–like you said, investing in myself and going to college–for me to learn enough to get published.
During that time I met several women with the same goal. We formed a critique group and using our collective knowledge and experience in the industry, analyzed each others’ manuscripts and managed to get 10 out of 12 members published within two years of forming the group. I’d say that was pretty successful!
Is there such a group for screenwriters. Can someone start one? The only cost is the time you spend critiquing others, and while critiquing others you often learn to spot your own weaknesses as well.
It sounds as if there are some crit groups for insiders. But what about those starting out? Maybe there are groups out there. I have no idea. But my advice would be to network with each other! Someone always knows someone inside, or gets a snippet of info here and there. If ya’ll share this stuff, as well as your knowledge and experience, I think you’ll be amazed at the results.
~Ann, who hopes she’s not out of line but can’t help adding her two pennies.
Bravo is what I say, from my biased POV: I am a script consultant, and I have yet to have a client who was disappointed in my services and/or felt they didn’t get their money’s worth. To me, having a good analysis of a draft before you go out with it is a necessity, pure and simple. Screenwriters should think of it as a final exam for a “finished draft.” And if more of them invested in same… etc. etc.
Ann,
Your two pennies are always welcome… I was actually talking about the 18 people who emailed me sometime today.
Here’s a few comments…
“Pay someone to read my scripts? Are you crazy?”
–Uh… I guess so. LOL.
“Why should I listen to an analyst? Who the hell are they anyway?”
–Uh… You’re right. Probably not a good idea for you.
“By God, I am for real, Unk. And I don’t need anybody to tell me I’m not.”
–Uh… You are definitely for real. I wholeheartedly agree.
“Where am I supposed to get this money from?”
–Uh… The same place you always get your money from.
These do go on. Some were meaner. Some were in complete agreement.
I think it would be an outstanding idea if WE… Meaning the “collective we” could get something going when it comes to reading scripts and providing a little feedback. I’m all for saving money and for the most part, if you know what you’re doing and open to learning and education, you probably don’t need an analyst.
On the flip side of that coin, I’ve certainly read enough screenplays that would sincerely BENEFIT from a professional analysis.
Oh well… You can’t make everybody happy.
Unk
I’ve been hired as a Story Analyst or Story Editor on a whack of projects over the years - I guess because I have a good sense of story and how to give helpful and productive notes…and I suppose my name has lent some credibility to smaller projects. I know it was never something I took casually and wanted only to help the project 1) get better, and 2) be tailored to better navigate the waters to (hopefully) production. I hope I was worth what I was paid.
So why all the emails? Why not just comment? What are people afraid to say ‘outloud’?
Just wonderin’…
Script Writer’s egos are the biggest barrier between them and a successful career — which is the reason we are so resistant to taking notes from people.
What is ironic is the more professional the screenwriter, the more open they are to the idea of notes — screenwriting isn’t an art that happens in isolation and it’s never one person’s vision — eventually a director and producer are going to get involved and at that point the script is going to change.
But I’ve a more compelling reason for people to use a script consultant — experience — prior to using a script consultant I got knocked back by every company I sent scripts to — since developing my scripts through multiple drafts with a consultant, I’ve had three option offers on the same script in the last six months.
What we need most as writers (no matter how good we are) are two things, some humility and good notes.
Tell me about it. I’ve read alot of hopeless mss myself. One of the biggest problems is one you just mentioned: the writer has to be open to learning. And you’d hope if someone had the good sense to hire Billy, they’d listen!
That’s actually why I’ve been hanging around with you and Billy and MM. I don’t have any screenwriting ambitions, but I recognize brilliant writing teachers when I see them ;) I’m learning alot about craft from you guys–the kind of general stuff any kind of writer needs to know, as well as master-level stuff.
For that, I thank you!
I have never hired a script analyst - yet. Mostly because my finished ones are so bad they will never, never see the light of day (don’t need to pay someone to tell me they suck!)and I’m not done with my current one.
It strikes me that those who balk at paying someone to read their script are closed off to learning/improving from other’s feedback - which would make them the least likely to benefit.
However, movies being a collaborative business, they are in for a rude shock when every Tom, Dick, and Harry producer, studio exec., and director start “improving”, “tightening”, and “reworking”.
WC,
The internet is FULL OF LURKERS who wait for that ONE THING to pull them out of lurking status even if it’s just an email to voice their opinion… And while I can appreciate the email, I would much rather see constructive comments so that WE CAN ALL get something out it.
If you can believe this, somebody emailed me and wanted to know what coffee shop I write at so they could come and destroy my laptop… And I just put that in a nice way… LOL.
I almost wanted to reply back and tell them where because I guarantee it would be a difficult task… LOL.
Clive,
You hit it right on the head… Couldn’t agree more. Even when listening to suggestions or ideas that I don’t feel would work for the story, it’s often listening to those suggestions or ideas that can launch spin-offs in other directions… So it’s ALL GOOD.
Ann,
Aw shucks… Thanks!
Lisa,
You make a great point… If you KNOW that your work isn’t quite up to snuff yet because of experience, knowledge of the craft, or whatever, then hiring an analyst makes no sense until that one day you wake up and realize you’ve made it to that level — whether you’ve sold anything or not.
Thanks everyone for the comments!
Good discussion!
Unk
Blake Snyder (Save the Cat) is a very good consultant, too. He worked with me over a period of six weeks on a particular SP and I learned more from him during that time than at all the workshops I’ve ever attended. I tried Mike Cheda, wasn’t impressed. Didn’t meet the agreed-to time table and skimmed rather than read. Colleagues have recommended Dave Trottier, too.
Interesting.
Doesn’t Blake Snyder recommend Cheda in his book?
Unk
Yup. That’s why I tried Cheda first. Blake doesn’t advertise his consulting services (at least he didn’t when I used him) and he’s expensive but worth the investment (and that’s how I look at it - an investment in my future).
There are two online forums where screenwriters can go to critique each other’s work and get feedback on their own. They are Zoetrope and Triggerstreet.
I’m on Triggerstreet. I was already a writer when I started, but I didn’t know how to write screenplays. Now I’m a screenwriter.
Any forum made up of writers who want to help each other is only as good as the time each one puts in. At TS we have thousands of members, but only a small, core group of people who consistently put in the time both to help and to submit their own work.
It would be nice to have a professional consultant work with me. I figure I could do two things with the time I don’t spend at my job. I could get another job and pay a consultant to look at one screenplay, or I could log on to Triggerstreet every day and be part of a community of writers. I’ve gotten a lot of valuable feedback from people who are doing it only out of their love of the craft.