Funk email…
Posted on April 13, 2008
Filed Under Uncategorized
Dear Unk,
First of all, great blog. I really love it. It seems like the first half hour of our weekly screenwriting group talks about what we learn from your blog. Thanks so much for that.
So here’s my funk.
I moved to Los Angeles 5 years ago. I’ve written 13 screenplays and I still can’t get an agent or manager to represent me. I’ve actually had a couple of indie film writing assignments where I successfully script-doctored those screenplays before shooting. But these jobs are so few and far between. I do have a day job but I’m really growing tired of the daily grind of it.
I really thought that by now I really would have nailed down a halfway decent screenwriting career for myself but I keep finding out how difficult it is. Like one of your frequent visitors, Josh says, “I think I got game.” But now I’m really starting to wonder if I actually do have game.
That is why I’m attaching 5 of what I think are my best pages. Please don’t feel like you have to jump on this right away.
Whenever it is convenient for you.
Do I have game?
Okay, I get a lot of emails like this… Unfortunately, most of them attach the entire screenplay. LOL. I am holding back the author’s handle but I did write her back after I sat down and read her five pages and even asked her if she’d mind if I posted this email since I get so many of them like this.
She said, “No problem but please don’t post my 5 pages.”
No problem.
Oh woe is me… Let’s call the author of the above email, Sandy.
Sandy,
First of all, let me just tell you that it takes balls to just go ahead and send an attachment like you did. I don’t know if I admire your tenacity or just feel like it’s another rude intrusion into my oh so boring life… i.e., I ain’t got nothin’ better to do than to read your 5 pages.
The good news?
At least it was only 5 pages.
I also like that it seems to be the first 5 pages of your screenplay so at least I can get a feel for your story but I didn’t. So let’s go through it best I can on such short notice… I don’t know… I guess I’m old school because I really like reading the following two words at the beginning of a screenplay:
FADE IN:
I don’t know… There’s just something about those two simple words that somehow prepare me for what follows… It tells me I’m not reading a poem, an article, a short story, or a letter… It tells me I’m reading a screenplay.
But hey, everybody’s different and by no means is sticking ‘FADE IN:’ at the top of your screenplay a hard and fast rule.
One reason I’m really glad to see that these 5 pages are the first 5 pages of your screenplay is because just within these 5 pages alone, you’ve skipped ahead and made me read about 3 different characters without first introducing them to me. And from the names you’ve given them, I can’t tell if two of them are male or female but maybe that’s what you intended?
Naaah. I doubt it but I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. You introduce them later, right? LOL.
Sandy, I can’t even tell from the dialogue whether or not those two characters are male or female. The names are interesting however. Very bohemian, so I give you points for that.
And since this is only 5 pages, all I can tell is that everything takes place here:
INT. HOUSE - DAY
LOL. Is it a shitty little house? Is it a mansion? Is it in an average little neighborhood? What city is it in? Town? You start off with the location but then you orphan that location slug and get right into so and so character’s dialogue.
I’m still wondering where in the fuck they are and is this a crack house? Mommy and Daddy’s house? I can’t picture anything about this house at all because you didn’t give me anything to picture.
Same with the characters. 5 pages of fucking TALK TALK TALK.
Talking heads with a VENGEANCE!
Maybe you could give these fuckers something to do while they fuckin’ talk their asses off? Maybe one of them keeps changing the channels on the television with the remote and the other two get pissed at him or her… Maybe one of them picks their nose — rolls it up until it dries, and flicks it away. Yeah, then let the other two male or female characters get pissed at him or her for that.
Maybe one of them is looking at a porn magazine and is so entranced by what he or she is seeing that he or she’s having a real hard time communicating with the other two characters.
Which brings me to the dialogue.
You start off with one of the characters talking about his or her job… I will say this… You sure as hell didn’t leave anything out! I know nothing about this character but I know everything about where he or she works. Strangely, it even feels as if there’s a slight agenda going on here. As if this character is speaking for YOU personally. If I had to make a bet, I would bet that this particular character is based on yourself just from reading your emails thus far.
Since I couldn’t read past page 5, I have to wonder if your screenplay is about where this person works or… Is it about that person? Is it about that person and where that person works? At least then, this would make a little more sense to me. If so, I am assuming you are setting this all up so that the rest of the story follows this person around more or less.
*NOTE: As it turned out, Sandy emailed me back and told me that her screenplay was NOT in fact about that character NOR where that character worked.
But wow… If your story doesn’t follow this character and where he or she works, I gotta wonder why you put so much effort into these five pages. On top of that, you’re telling me that these five pages are your BEST. I do like some of the dialogue but geez… Did you really need to keep going back to UrbanDictionary.com to find slang that we’ve never heard of before? I think just a little too much… So much so that it’s almost too clever.
In fact, if these 5 pages don’t have much to do with the rest of the screenplay, then in fact, it’s way over the top.
And of course… Aside from the spelling errors and a couple of typos, the formatting is basically okay except that you seem to have a lot of orphan formatting in such a short amount of space so please watch out for that and IF you don’t know what I’m talking about…
Then no… You ain’t got game.
Unk
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As much as Sandy may be throwing herself onto a tire fire right now, I’m glad you shared this. You hear that as long as you’re a good writer you’ll make it if you just have patience and tenacity. Then you hear about people who’ve been out here forever and still can’t find writing work, and it’s disheartening.
But then you learn there’s a reason, so that’s a relief for those of us who are still relatively new to the game.
How do you go 13 years without knowing that you make these kinds of mistakes?
So Unk, I’m having problems reading between the lines. Does Sandy have game or not?
If not, do you think she ever will have game?
Do you think you should read the rest of her screenplay?
Erndoggie
emily,
I think that’s 13 screenplays but POINT TAKEN… LOL.
And you’d be surprised at how many scripts look like this — and supposedly coming from those who honest-to-fucking-God think their shit is THE SHIT. In fact, might I go so far as to say that these artistes feel as though we should completely forgive and or overlook the SMALL SHIT like:
typos
mispellings
orphans
missing introductions
in-your-face exposition
talking heads that go on and on and on
147 pages
missing structure
yada yada yada
Because their shit is SO GOOD that we should be able to use our EX-RAY VISION to see the good shit buried underneath.
And Sandy, I applaud you for letting us talk about your script. A few more emails reveals that Sandy has been listening to too many people in her screenwriting group who also think they know how to write and that as long as the good shit is buried underneath, we’ll find it.
Erndoggie,
How’s this for clarification:
Sandy AIN’T GOT GAME.
Will she ever? I think Sandy suffers from the same thing many newbies suffer from… Being too clever. Save CLEVER for the STORY. I’d rather read a great fucking story than quirky dialogue.
I can tweak dialogue till the cows come home… If I have to tweak your entire story, why not write my own or go somewhere else?
Do I think she could have game one day?
Of course. As I’ve already told Sandy — we even used the CHAT function here so she could get it on demand… She needs to start reeling in her stories. I’m afraid she’s probably got to start from scratch. A quick refresh of formatting so those basic mistakes don’t slow someone like me down. Then move on to at least basic structure.
There’s a reason for it.
You’d be surprised how far structure will take you. If you’ve got IMAGINATION (GAME), structure will trigger you when to UP your game.
Above the baseline.
Unk
EDIT: Do I think I should read the rest of her screenplay? Nope.
I have very little game. I am slowly getting game as I practice, but I’m never gonna be the Kobe of screenwriters.
With that said…I have a pretty good idea what “orphan formatting” is based on some things Unk has said in the past, but I Googled it so I could pretend like I got more game than I actually got. The only thing I see on the first page of results that’s related to screenwriting is this very post. So now I got no game and I’m trapped in a wormhole of some sort.
BTW, to Sally:
I asked Unk to read something of mine when I first found this site and got pretty much some of the same critiques.
Now, let’s be honest — Unk keeps it real, and sometimes real can sting. At first, I was pissed and wanted to spout off at him. I mean who the fuck does this guy think he is? Right? But I decided to take a step back, let my anger subside, take his criticism to heart, and learn from my mistakes.
That’s my charge to you. Take what he said and learn from it. He wouldn’t waste time on you if he didn’t think it would help.
Nick,
I admit that I’m a fucking piece of work when it comes to screenwriting — meaning — I AIN’T POLITICALLY CORRECT.
And come on… You don’t really want me to be, right?
Besides, I couldn’t sleep at night (day?) if I just played YES MAN to people really trying to do this. There’s too many others out there that got that PC shit down.
I never will.
Hell, they even charge you for it! LOL. At least here, it’s free.
Sometimes you just have to SLAP somebody’s shit back at them because they’re just not being realistic. I’m not saying that I know all… Please — PLEASE always feel free to get a second, third, and fourth opinion.
That’s why I WARN people before I sign on to read their script… I want to read something WAY ABOVE THE LINE. I expect to! You wouldn’t be bothering me unless it was, RIGHT?
Right. LOL.
So when it isn’t in my own humble opinion, I call it likes I sees it.
But I would never tell someone to QUIT. I always send them back to the drawing board AND with some of my own tips and tricks to get them started.
Because I want everyone to succeed. I want everyone’s game above the SHIT that we keep watching.
Unk
LOL. Oh… You’re THAT NICK!
You think I ripped YOU to shreds? I thought you were the Nick I caused to run to the mountains to become a hermit.
Whew.
Unk
You could’ve replaced Sandy’s name with mine. I ain’t got game. LOL
Since I’m new… I’ve been thinking. Bare with me cause I’m thinking out loud here and don’t really know how to put all this into words.
Unk and da’ pros out there want to read a screenplay with action. More action less dialogue. If I’m wrong, please correct me ANYONE.
Would it be possible if we could right our screenplay without dialogue at first, or don’t focus on dialogue as much? Then add the dialogue after? So we can get our story down and focus on the action and not just talking heads? Not excatly like this but somehow keep this in mind… Or am I just way out there and should just give this up and start writing poems or some shit?
Ryan,
That’s as valid a way of doing it as any… That’s why I preach structure so much. Get the structure down. Then outline according to your structure. Inevitably, you’re going to do some things OUTSIDE your chosen structure because it feels right to do so…
When you outline according to your structure, you’re more or less writing your screenplay WITHOUT dialogue. Yes, I believe you can write without actually writing.
So when you have all this down and dirty and then begin to play your movie at least once every day (more is preferable), your dialogue should be a matter of simply filling in the blanks — ASSUMING you know your characters backwards, forwards, sideways, and all ways.
Unk
I quit reading at “hard time communicating” after telling me he was reading a porn magazine. Sides hurt. Need air. Be back later.
Sorry, bit of a rant here, but here goes….
I moved to LA, all the way from London, with a ‘dream’ to write movies. I had a great life in London, lots of friends, my entire family, a well paid job; I’ve given it all up to follow my dream.
I never understand people who say they want to be a pro screenwriter, but appear to make no ‘gesture’ to become a paid writer. I don’t know how long ‘Sandy’ spent writing 13 screenplays and to be blunt, judging from UNK’s remarks, I can’t imagine any of them are written in at least a professional format, but even a seasoned Hollywood writer would struggle putting out say 3 GOOD scripts a year, the old Quality versus Quantity rule seems at play.
I’m still full of enthusiasm for LA, as I’m still a relative LA newbie, but I’ve tried to ‘act’ like a pro, from day one. For me that meant the following:
-Writing everyday, even when I couldn’t be fucked, when I was hung-over, stressed and busy or feeling as creative as an Earthworm.
-Signing up for the UCLA Extension and taking screenwriting classes with pro writers, right from the scratch classes, although I had read a LOT of books on screenwriting, while still in Europe. When one has a writer with credits for blockbuster movies, telling you how to get your shit together, you listen. I’m not working on commission for UCLA Ext, but if someone wants to be a pro, I don’t understand how they can buy a few books from Borders and expect to become the next Aaron Sorkin. Writers group are all good, but learning from a seasoned pro seems a given if you want to be a pro.
-Trying to network with people since arriving in LA, even when I was hung-over, stressed, busy or feeling as entertaining as an Earthworm.
-Knowing the key to Hollywood; what movies earn, how they are made, how screenplays get sold, how every other writer in this town, ‘broke in’. All this knowledge keeps your feet on the ground and what it takes to break in.
-Scanning the web for screenplays, good ones, bad ones and every one in between, reading them. I don’t want to make the next ‘Knocked up’, but I’ll read the screenplay, check out the careers of the writers, know how much this movie made at the box office.
-I have no doubt I will break in, simply because creative writing has always been my passion, I’ll try to continue to act like a pro and I WILL NEVER GIVE UP. I’m sure there’s a truckload of writers getting paid serious cash who’ve only drifted in writing late in life, but anyone who’s even as young as 18 and hasn’t got boxes and boxes of shit they’ve written since they were a kid, can they claim writing is a passion? Or are you trying the writer suit on to see if it’s fit?
But what the fuck do I know? I’ve never sold anything. I sat around for years in a non creative job and wrote loads of shit at home, never showing it to anyone. But a journey of a 1000 miles begins with that first step to LA, as the great UNK says, Sandy don’t give up! UNK advice is spot on!!
MaryAnita,
Ah… You got it. I was hoping someone would. LOL.
Marty,
Thanks for the comment and WELCOME! I’m sure somewhere on this site, I’ve delved into most if not all of things you’re currently doing on your outstanding list…
I couldn’t agree MORE. I highly recommend acting like a PRO from the GET-GO. Writing when the will just isn’t there. Reading SHIT because in this business, you even have to keep up on the SHIT.
Networking. Boxoffice. Deals. The trades. Interviews. Articles, books, and blogs.
If you can just pick up one decent nugget of information a week, you’re doing GREAT.
Sandy already emailed me AGAIN to say thanks for pimping her out there. She says she’s been living in a cloud of her screenwriting group patting everyone on the back but nobody ever really moving forward.
I honestly think Sandy can make it as long as she veers back to the highway. She’s been going off road for quite a while now and it’s starting to show.
I haven’t read anything but those 5 pages but there was enough decent dialogue in there that tells me Sandy can write. What I “think” she needs to do — and I’ve told her this — is to reel it all back in and put it in some kind of order so it makes sense.
Even though she tells me that she’s using 3 Act Structure, I can’t see it in those 5 pages. Sometimes it’s simply a matter of having structure explained until you GET IT.
Some of us get it right away — others struggle with it and never even learn about it until years after they’ve been writing.
From chatting with her earlier today, I get the feeling that a lot of the pieces are in fact there but they need rearranging.
Hence, why I said “Back to the drawing board.”
9 times out of 10 when writers tell me they’re STUCK and can’t seem to move forward, it’s their characters. They will argue till they are blue in the face that they KNOW THEIR FUCKING CHARACTERS really really well and when I ask a couple of questions…
Oops.
They don’t know that answer… In fact, they can’t even ADLIB an answer which is usually what I’m looking for. If you know your characters as well as you should, you can usually speak for them on any topic and if you don’t know the answer to a specific question, you should be able to WING it as if you knew it all the time.
If you can’t — it could be why the characters aren’t moving forward.
Great comments! Everybody learns. Love the way that works!
Unk
Hey UNK!
Thanks for the welcome!! Your blog is brill and I’m suggesting the link to my fellow newbie writers from the UCLA extension classes!! Your blog may be already on the useful website lists from school, I’m working my way down the list!
What you write here echoes perfectly what the writers at school tell me, whose credits include, Toy Story 2, Scream and Things to do in Denver, amongst others.
I just wish I had found your site when I was back in London, dreaming about moving to LA to become a writer. These past few months have been a REAL STEEP learning curve. Just reading a big, thick book on screenwriting isn’t going to address things like grammar and typo’s, something the writers at school were fanatical about. That’s before you even START breaking down structure, character, etc.
For newbie writers, your advice is top notch!
Really hope the type of questions I would have probably asked only last year, don’t get you down and you continue this excellent blog!
Cheers!
Martin.
And Unk is back. Now if anyone has game, it’s Unk.
From my experience, the only way a screenwriting “group” is going to help you is if each person in it takes it upon themselves to find the NEGATIVES in the script instead of just saying, “I loved it, keep going!”, because how is that going to help? The only way to make a script better is to rip it to hell from every possible angle.
You need the people reading your scripts to challenge you, make you think twice, tell you what they really thought, if they think it sucked then they need to tell you they think it sucked. Or you may as well give it to to your mother-in-law to read. Because it has to be rewritten and rewritten until it is perfect and everyone’s honest opinion is finally that it really is a great script.
Then after that, send it to a person who gets paid to read and cover scripts, or someone like Unk who will give you an educated, real reaction to the script.
Because let me tell you, like Sandy’s situation may have proved, there is nothing mroe harmful to your screenwriting career than a group of writers telling you how good you are when they don’t really have a clue, or want to hurt your feelings.
And make sure the person giving you feedback is a better damn writer than you and knows this shit inside and out and can actually prove they are worth their opinion, if you don’t want to pay the “pro’s” for the same thing.
And instead of churning out 3 scripts a year that may be mediocre or maybe good, take your time, puch yourself, challenge yourself to raise your game and create a really powerful script that everyone sees as the next best script. Otherwise, what’s the firggin point?
I have been writing for 16 years. I have written 15 screenplays. Only the last three, from the reactions and success of them, were even close to being good enough. The first 13 were shit! And the timeline? the last three scripts were written over the last 5 years. because I took my time, got to know my characters, lived with them, beat the shit out of them, and listened to them as to where they wanted to go in certain situations.
My formula (more or less):
* Come up with a kick-ass good as gold, no two ways about it, idea. * Create the types of characters that will bring the most life, excitement, conflict, tension and drama to your script. * Structure an unbreakable plot in an unbreakable structure and then beat the shit out of it to make sure it holds firm. * Outline from fade in to fade out so you know this story more than your own life story. * Write the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Rewrite the screenplay. * Get my trusted readers to tear me a new asshole about all of the problems of the script and why it sucks. Rewrite ad nausium.
Then I send off to a trusted industry professional to let me know the real reaction.
My point is, spend the real time needed to create a story worth people investing millions in. Otherwise, retire, because it just ain’t gonna happen.
End of ramble.
Glad to see there’s a new dove hatchling in your life. Let’s hope this one works out.
Great post = thank you for kickstarting my Monday morning and extra thanks to ‘Sandy’ for the bravado.
One question.
I write thrillers.
The great temptation is to open with an action scene which is intriguing, exciting and exhilarating for the audience/reader, and creating the hook into the crime and the world of the crime where the detective will have come back to.
Except of course I have just killed off a character the audience has invested their time on. Hopefully emphasises and sympathises with.
The next scene introduces our kiss ass heroine protag detective and the set-up in her ordinary world - a complete contrast.
If I have done my work, this is a character the audience/reader will be interested in.
But the first 5 pages will be about someone who will drive the investigation - and I have just killed.
Do you think this is still a valid approach in such a short attention span world?
Marty,
Questions never really get me down as much as ridiculous and baseless arguments… Which goes back to those “artistes” that just want to argue the basics. The basics are the basics are the basics…
At least asking a question means you want to learn something… LOL. Arguing that people like me should be able to use our EX-RAY VISION to see what’s buried underneath the masterpiece makes me tired.
Questions are ALWAYS WELCOME.
Scott,
Thanks for pointing out a huge TRUTH that I keep trying to pass on…
And that is… One should be ready to put 1 or 2 years into a script to get it into shape. LIVING with a story for over a year really can improve the story as long as you actually run through that story (in your mind) at least once daily.
I tend to think that many of us are always trying to catch up and by being in that mindset, we push — really push to finish our screenplays in record time.
Nothing wrong with that as long as the script is above the line AMAZING. All to often however, we read scripts that really could have been amazing if the writer had simply slowed down a bit and made sure he or she really knew the territory and characters they’ve developed.
But having said that, a lot of writers just feel they can whip out an above the line script in record time and so they attempt to do just that and then move on to the next script and the next and the next…
When really, they could have honed that one script that really had a great concept and elevated it way above the mark.
There’s also nothing wrong with having several scripts sitting on the shelf incubating for more improvements as long as you actually do that.
There’s also nothing worse than having several crappy scripts on the shelf not incubating at all.
Because when the inevitable does finally happen and you are asked that inevitable question, “What else ya got?”
Don’t you want whomever reads your screenplays to be amazed after every read instead of only one read?
Elver,
Not sure what you’re referring to but you know what? It always works out…
Unk
Ray-Anne,
I also write thrillers… Sure, this approach still works. I personally like to see those first 5 pages do the following:
Set the mood of the story
Set the scope of the story
Set the tone of the story
Set the style of the story
Give the audience just a glimpse of the Antagonist or Protagonist… If the Antagonist, it could be the actual antagonist or something that the antagonist has done. Could be a victim of the Antagonist. Could be something that is part of the Antagonist’s overall plan. If the Protagonist, we’re probably reaching into the Protagonist’s past a bit. Maybe revealing the Protagonist’s fatal flaw — bringing up the question of theme.
The first 5 pages can also begin showing us the Protagonist’s ordinary world as well as begin introducing other main characters of the story.
I think what YOU’RE describing can easily work if done correctly…
Unk
UNK,
When you asked me to write a little bit about my experience using a script consultant, almost this exact scenario popped in my head as a reason to use one.
I didn’t address it specifically, but mentioned that there was a gap between what I had thought I had written and what I had actually written.
The scenario I had in my head is that someone can be writing screenplays for 10 years, just show them to friends and families, enter some contests and receive a slew of rejection letters, BUT since their friends and family (or even screenwriting group, apparently) like their scripts, they think they’re just not getting a fair shake. But the reality they don’t see is that they are very FAR from being where they need to be to sell a script.
The biggest benefit to a script consultant (even if you just fork out for ONE consultation, and assuming it’s a good consultant) is that you find out where you stand as a writer and receive a clearer understanding of what you need to do to succeed.
Sandy was lucky enough for UNK to respond for free. But most writers (me included) aren’t lucky to know someone who knows screenwriting like UNK, and thus using a consultant may be the only way to get a good and HONEST opinion of your work from someone who knows what they’re talking about.
And as far as living with a script for a year or two to really nail it, I completely agree.
My personal process is, once I get an idea that I want to turn into a script, create a new word document, divide it into 3 acts and just fill it with ideas that pop in my head for it. Could be complete scenes, could be one line of dialog, could be a character description, etc… I’ll usually do this while working on another script. It’s funny how ideas flow for a script when they aren’t the script you’re focusing on.
It’s during this process that I make the hard decisions of what scenes will be integral to the story and figure out the logistics that will make it “believable.” Not believable on a “I can’t believe giant crabs are eating New York” level, but on a structural level where the actions and the flow of the stroy make sense. Once that’s nailed, you’re ready to write, I think.
I should read all the posts before posting… basically what Scott said…
Unk, does this mean you’re outa your funk? :)
I wanted to add - I disagree with you a little bit, Unk (and here’s where you laugh and go, REALLY? That never happens - LOL) But I think Sandy does have some game . . .
While the sample she sent you may not, the impulse behind it and, more importantly, HOW SHE DEALT WITH IT (she kept communicating to you afterwards, striving to understand) right away separates her from many other writers . . .
Because she’s shown she can take a punch.
I know a lot of writers, and I’ve been in a lot of writing groups, all types of different disciplines of writing, and one thing I know is most don’t want to have to take a punch, they don’t want someone to tell them it doesn’t work, it’s terrible, there’s nothing there - mostly they want a safe environment where they’re appreciated.
And I want that, too. Everyone does.
The thing is, to compete in the Big Dance, you gotta take some shots. You have to send your stuff out there and someone’s gonna shake their head and go, “uh-uh”.
And the thing is, often times they’ll be right. Sometimes they won’t be, many great scripts out there have been turned down or dumped on, and there are assholes who delight in telling a writer that they suck, those people do exist.
But you’re not gonna be able to differentiate between the assholes and the folks telling the brutal truth if you don’t go out into the world and take some hits. If you don’t try to understand the nature of what it is you’re attempting and how far and how short you are in getting there.
If you don’t crash and burn a few times, even the great comedians do the same (and if you haven’t seen the documentary COMEDIAN, about Seinfield and the work he puts into his craft, do so right away) they all have to die a few times before they live.
No one WANTS to die onstage, but comedians understand that’s part of the process of honing their act.
You gotta crash and burn and take some shots to get better, it’s an ugly but an important part of the process.
I know some talented writers who simply couldn’t deal with it, don’t want to deal with it, only want everyone to tell them how great they are. And there are plenty of groups where a guy or a gal can be the big fish in a little pond and no one ever quibbles and, more importantly, no one challenges them.
Sandy seems to be putting herself out there . . . that type of dissatisfaction is often what leads to greater discoveries later on - she knows something’s off, she knows she’s not realized it yet, she suspects it and that’s why she’s put her ass on the line - and taking the shots will either cow it forever or drive her to new heights.
I suspect it will be the latter.
A lot of theatre folk always ask me why I did so much kickboxing (at least I did before my son was born) and they always ask with a skeptical eye because, well, they’re theatre people - LOL - and I always say the same thing - “you find out a lot about yourself when you get punch in the face”.
And it’s true. Some folks don’t want to know that kinda stuff. They want to sit in their safe circles and the comfort of consistent sameness.
Whereas the people who strive and achieve are rarely satisfied with where they are and instead yearn for somewhere more, be it craft or anything.
Which means you’re gonna fall on your ass on the way there.
Very few people win first time out the gate. Michael Jordan didn’t make his junior varsity team in HS, and it so pissed him off, he never forgot it.
You gotta taste the bitter to get to the better. You gotta take some lumps, you have to fail before you can succeed and it sucks a lot of the time, but sometimes it makes you better and stronger.
So that’s just my opinion, for better or worse, while I think you’re right in your analysis, I do think she’s got some gumption, and that counts too . . . I’m also glad you did this post, Unk, like everyone else is . . . this is great stuff.
It reminds me of this story, I can’t remember where I read it, but it always resonated.
A young girl loved to dance ballet, she studied it for years since she was small. One time this Ballet Master came to the village where she lived and she went to the Master and asked her, “Do I have what it takes to be a great ballerina?”
The Master looked her up and down. Looked her in the eye. Said “No.”
The young girl took it hard, cried for a bit. Then sighed and went on with her life, gave up ballet, went to school, got married and had a wonderful family.
Years later, when she was a mother and her own children studied dance, she ran into the Ballet Master, now even older. She reminded him of who she was, thanked him for his advice many years earlier, told him how happy she was.
But before she left, she asked him, “How did you know I didn’t have what it takes to be a great ballerina?”
The Master smiled at her and said, “Because you took my word for it.”
That’s the story.
Keep on fighting and sooner or later, you won’t have to ask anyone if you have game.
They’ll be telling you.
Hey UNK,
You mean I could have sent you some pages. FUCK. Now I’m really in a funk. :-)
Anyway, you touched on something that I brought up over at Billy Mernit’s. That’s BEING CLEVER. I hate clever. I MEAN I HATE CLEVER.
Clever should get hit by a car and die.
As far as Sandy, perhaps she should slow down. If she has a day job and really wrote more than two scripts a year, she is rushing and not building the story from an outline. Well, that’s my opinion.
Perhaps she’s not reading enough scripts. http://www.dailyscript.com
But then, not everyone can be a screenwriter. Just like not everyone can be an actor or a football player or lawyer.
Perhaps, she’d be better as a producer or director. i too wish everyone success but it’s hard when a major problem is a dearth of scripts that should have never been sent out.
If you aren’t reading about the craft - not McKee - but Seger or Weston, you are doing everyone a disservice. I really got serious about this in Feb of last year and I didn’t write a script until May.
I read tons of scripts, blogs, articles, program books (Tisch, etc.) before writing FADE IN:
My first scripts were simple, character-driven movies with no stereotypes or twists. Don’t try to be Mamet or Tarantino or Cody. Be yourself. Characterize like people you know.
Anyway, I’m back to my political thriller.
Keep Writing as Writing is the Revealing of the Soul.
I really hope I won’t regret this but I’m Sandy. No my name isn’t Sandy so thank you for that Unk. First off, let me apologize for sending you those five pages. I too was in a major funk and just felt like if I didn’t do something extreme, this funk would never end and I would end up moving back to Orange, Texas.
Unk didn’t share my email with y’all but oh my god did he nail it. To be honest, I figured I would send the pages and never hear back because I’ve done the same on some other blogs in the scribosphere. And, in a weird way, I thought since nobody ever read or looked at my stuff, I thought that was a good thing. What was really interesting was that after I sent the pages, I somewhat came out of my funk because of that same cloud I’ve been in for quite a while now. It was as if the act of sending Unk those pages meant and made me feel as though:
I have game.
Unk took my five pages and made so many notes on those five pages that I am still going through them and finally understanding most of them. In fact, he sent me back a pdf that had the same file name but at the end of the file it said: Unk-Notes.
I knew I didn’t have game when I received that email because to be perfectly honest, I didn’t have the nerve to open that email for hours.
It kept calling to me though. Then when I did, it was full of yellow sticky notes and when I say everywhere, I mean everywhere!
He even took the time to point the super small tiny stuff that I know I already know about but for some reason, neglected to take care of.
At first I was going to argue with him but he could already tell that I was going to do that and subverted that feeling by telling me what I was actually feeling after having read his email.
Who the fuck is this guy? lol. Are you really a guy?
To say this has been a revelation for me is an understatement.
Unk made a list of posts for me to read and ask questions about. He made a list of books for me. Some I already have and to be honest, I’ve never actually read them the way I should have read them.
Luckily, today was my day off so I’ve been sitting in my little apartment going through all this stuff and it’s like all of a sudden I can’t get enough.
All because I sent some guy five pages of my crap.
Thanks Unk. Really, truly.
aislin
aislin,
No problem. Keep writing.
Josh,
I guess I should have clarified that I meant Sandy’s (aislin’s) screenplay didn’t have game. I would never assume a person doesn’t have game because of a screenplay.
I have no doubt however, that it will eventually have game.
Ah… Now we’ve done the PC thing… Let me pat myself on my back and have a beer. LOL.
Yeah, I’m outta my funk now. I buried the little bird in the back yard. If I knew where the other commentor (m) lived, I’d have invited him to the funeral.
So we could talk. LOL.
Tom,
As usual — great points!
Unk
Unk - I’m telling you, one of these days, I’m gonna be the guy buying you that beer, that’s my word . . .
Unk,
I never moved to the hills, but I did catch a hermit crab at the beach one time.
I’m glad the artist formerly known as Sandy has stepped up to the plate. Unk has that ability — to cut you down so hard it makes you wanna be better.
“…it was full of yellow sticky notes and when I say everywhere, I mean everywhere!”
LMFAO!!!!
Oh that’s great Aislin! Sounds like we have somethings in common. LOL.
I feared opening my email to read what he had to say. I couldn’t wait cause I was getting too nervous and had to get it over with.
Unk is right on this and everything on his blog. He has a way of knocking me on my ass and somehow gets me loving it, too!
I’ve been stuck on something on my script and have been asking him what I can do. He responds back by saying it’s my characters! Simply: It’s my character.
Huh.
I get thinking about if for a minute and SURE enough… It’s my flippin’ characters. I knew my protags and antags and not shit about my other characters and those are the ones that spur me through the end.
Just like Josh said… We all have to take punches and I actually LOOK FORWARD TO THOSE! That’s when I get to correct a bad habit of mine.
I spend countless hours on this site, just trying to learn all I can. Unk thanks for all the time you do on your site to get the little bastards like myself goin’. Same with Josh’s and MM. Very informative. Without this site I wouldn’t have started this interest/passion that I had cause I didn’t know where to start. Even though Josh tend to disagree with him sometimes. I’m way too young to even think that. Whatever Unk says… I’m goin’ with it.
Aislin,
You got game. You also are miles ahead of most of us wannabe screenwriters– you moved to L.A. — to live the dream. That takes game.
I live 2557.76 miles from Hollywood (give or take) — breaking into the biz long distance sucks — you made the right move getting out of Texas and into LaLa land.
I recently had a request for one of my scripts from a known ProdCo and sent it in knowing full well (in my head anyway) that it would be a pass. In my heart I hoped otherwise. It was a pass. Yet, even though I expected the pass, it hurt. Everyone thinks they have game and, I guess, game is subjective. (why else would a 6th round draft pick end up becoming All-Pro in the NFL, but I digress). The point is, I wanted to quit, convinced I wasn’t good enough, I was wasting my time. But you know what? I didn’t. I won’t. Today after work I will drive to the bookstore and start a new screenplay. And tomorrow I will drive to that same bookstore and continue to write. Day after day ad nausea. Why? Because I can’t NOT write. Maybe I’ll never sell a script. Maybe I will. But if I quit, if you quit, we’ll never know.
So, Aislin, listen to Unk. He’ll be tough. He’ll frustrate you. Piss you off. Make you so mad you could bite a brad in two. But you will learn. Soak up his knowledge. Pick his brain. He’ll make you a better writer. And don’t quit. Never quit.
Keep Writing.
Josh,
Don’t worry… I’ll let you beer me up. LOL.
Nick,
I wasn’t talking about you… There was another Nick from over a year ago who decided to stop writing.
And it’s all my fault… But please make note… I never tell anyone to stop writing.
EVER.
Mike,
Sounds like you’ve got some personal experience at this… LOL.
Thanks for the comments everybody… Always good to read this stuff.
I mean WHERE ELSE we gonna read it?
Unk
According to this webpage I live about 5646 miles from Hollywood.
The actual travel time on the information superhighway is about 300 milliseconds, though. Add another 30-40 milliseconds during rush hour.
UNK,
I just stumbled upon this site, and I gotta say, it’s pretty ballin, like a dream for someone wanting to get into the film industry.
My question is… Are nonlinear plotlines acceptable? Because they’ve obviously been done before (Pulp Fiction, Sin City) and they tend to be fairly well recieved by audiences, but it would also seem that they are more on the novel side of things rather than the screenplay side of things. I like a lot of film genres, from noir to thrillers, but I am very intrigued by nonlinear plots, or abstract plots, what are your thoughts on this?
Elver,
Save some money — board that plane. LOL.
Adam,
Welcome to The Unknown Screenwriter. A dream? Wow. First time I heard that one… LOL.
Much appreciated!
Nonlinear plotlines are totally acceptable as long as they don’t make me think and feel that you derived the structure from some other nonlinear plot.
Nothing wrong with stealin’ as long as you don’t get caught. LOL.
I recently caught THE LOOKOUT and it wasn’t unbelievably terrible but it kept making me think MEMENTO.
Not good.
But hey — it got made.
Unk
Memento… really? I saw THE LOOKOUT and I really like it a lot. One of my favorites from last year. But it doesn’t remain me to MEMENTO at all. Actually it makes me think more at COLLATERAL. I don’t know why but it did. The interesting of those two films are that you actually can separate one genre from the another. its obvious that most of the films have two genres and one of them always gonna be the PRIME one. Like DRAMA/THRILLER. But the COOL about those two films is that you can divide them in two parts and just one specific genre two each part. The first part a DRAMA and the second part a THRILLER. The first time I saw COLLATERAL I get SCOCKED by the way this film turns out to be at the end. It was first a DRAMA. Then damn!!! it result to be a thriller. And a great one.
THE LOOKOUT made me think of graphic novels. Or comic books as they used to be called. Good ones. None of that men in spandex nonsense.
But you guys should take a look at LONDON TO BRIGHTON. Great European film.
I’ve noticed new writers(un-produced/un-optioned) get in a real twist around non-linear plots, like doing a non-linear plot is somehow cool and will set their work apart. After speaking to a lot of writers(produced/optioned) I’ve been advised for a baby writer, it’s probably best to steer clear from a non-linear plot, simply because your not good enough to play with the structure. PULP FICTION wasn’t Tarantino’s first screenplay being shopped around, know structure and good story telling inside out before playing with the rules is what I constantly hear.
javisiete,
I liked it but not a lot… For what it’s worth — it’s worth watching. Maybe you need to watch MEMENTO again — then you’ll see the similarity.
Elver,
I guess I’m too old for THE LOOKOUT to remind me of the comic books I read as a kid.
Marty,
Based on pure numbers alone, I’d agree that the average newbie writer should learn basic structure backwards, forwards, sideways, and all ways before giving non-linear structure a try but there are always exceptions to the rule.
I guess I would put it like this… Give it a shot. No reason NOT TO. Then get somebody — preferably a few professionals — to read it. It it works — OUTSTANDING. If it doesn’t work…
Back to the drawing board… Which usually means learning as much about structure as you can and then going back and tweak. Even non-linear structure should be understandable by the people that read it.
Unk
to some of you guys,
I am sick and tired of people telling how you should handle your scriptwriting routine. “You are too fast, you should take more time, you should do this and do that.” Fuck you! The only thing that counts is the quality of your script. If you pour out the same shit quality writing in one day as in one year, it doesn’t make sense to spend more time doing the same shit.
So guys, give me a break. Better tell the writers that there are many ways to a great screenplays and some of them are working for you and others writers… but every writer has to find his or her way to that process which helps them most.
Heck, some writers have to pour out 5 shit scripts before getting to the one they like and write well.
Some writers spend 5 years on a script.
Some writers write 5 scripts simultanously.
So, please dont force a writer to write a script for 1 or 2 years if it is not his or her style. You might suggest.
Thomas
Thomas R.,
Whew… HOSTILITY.
I love it!
But I’m not sure who you’re talking to here since you say, SOME OF YOU GUYS… LOL.
So I’ll take it for granted that you’re talking to me…
I would assume that anyone that’s been around this site for awhile knows that I believe that everyone HAS THEIR OWN PROCESS…
But aye, here’s the rub… That don’t mean that their process is the RIGHT process.
Yow, that fuckin’ STINGS!
All I’ve ever said is this…
One should be ready to put 1 or 2 years into a script to get it into shape.
The key phrase here is SHOULD BE READY and let me throw one more phrase in the mix…
SHOULD BE WILLING. That’s right. Until a writer finds their process actually WORKS for them, more than likely, it can often use a little tweaking.
What kind of tweaking?
Who knows? So you keep trying different things… You keep reading different things and try them. You read screenplays and find ways that the writer handled certain things and then you attempt to emulate it but with your own unique style.
The process is never ending for most writers… NEVER ENDING and ALWAYS EVOLVING.
Sometimes it actually does take someone with a trained eye to tell someone else that THEY WENT TOO FAST… LOL.
I remember when I was in high school… I was in a welding class and I was welding for an hour a day… My welds were okay — nothing to write home about. Strong but ugly.
My teacher had quite a few certifications in welding… He could weld anything — literally. My POINT is that he had EXPERIENCE that I certainly DID NOT HAVE.
Now I could have simply gone on and on and on for another couple of years welding strong but ugly welds but he was looking over my shoulder one afternoon and tapped me on it.
I turned around, lifted my shield, and he says, “You’re going too fast… Slow it down.”
I thought he was an idiot for saying that but what the fuck did I know? I was only 17.
So I slowed down…
The welds came out beautiful and were obviously even STRONGER. I was chosen to weld a farming plow of my teacher’s own design. He gave me the blueprints and I built it. That plow is still being used today.
Had I not slowed down — I doubt it would still be in service.
But what the fuck do I know?
Unk
Unk, well what I meant was to make clear that nobody misinterprets and thinks it really takes 2 years of your life. Like you say, everyones got his/her method.
Nice story. You could use that one in one of your scripts for a tarantino style monologue/dialogue. Hehe.
But I agree, if a pro tells you something, he gotta know something you dont.
Tom
Tom,
I got a million of ‘em…
Stay cool.
Unk
Unk, well what I meant was to make clear that nobody misinterprets and thinks it really takes 2 years of your life.
Tom,
I think that’s exactly what he means… from his experience. I’m just about to a point where I think one of my scripts is ready to try and sell. I wrote the first draft about three years ago. At least two. Now, I didn’t work on this script solidly for two or three years… but, part of the process of working on a script is letting it sit for a while.
You’re right, everyone has his or her own method. But UNK’s a professional, as you concede. He KNOWS what it takes to write a script that’s good enough to sell. And he knows it takes 1-2 years.
There may be some out there who can do it quicker. But for new writers who, like teenage UNK, tend to want to rush things, it’s best to realize that you more than most likely aren’t going to be able to bang out a couple drafts in 6 months and the next day sell it to Paramount.
From my own personal experience, getting a script into good shape is a long and laborious road. There are many times when you think you’ve got it, but in reality still have a ways to go.
yep, I can agree with that. :)
Love this site! New to this form of writing…I live in Burquewood (aka Albuquerque). Lots of films being made here now and screenwriting is definitely “mi nicho.” After reading this string, I realize I need to slow down with my approach to allow more time for developing the story I am writing and absorb info on the industry. Compared to most of you, I think I am more Pollyanna as I do not use f*&^ all the time, but I appreciate the points being made and the opportunities to learn. So funny, from my initial reading on the homepage I thought UNK was a woman…hmmm.
REGARDING SANDY & HER 5 PAGES…
So lemme get this straight, she’s been in LA for five years and she’s written thirteen screenplays? In my humble opinion, that was the most revealing aspect of her post. Thirteen screenplays in five years??? Okay, let’s say ole “Sandy”, or whatever her freakin name is, started writing a few years before she mustered the guts to make her big move; let’s call it thirteen screenplays in eight years, shall we? Now let’s do a little math…
13 scripts in 96 months
And let’s just say, for the sake of Sandy being mortal, that she had to take like a month or so off inbetween scripts just to recharge the ole batteries. Which gets it down to 84 months of actual writing time, right? So…
13 scripts in 84 months
Which in turn works out to (& this is where the real math comes in) roughly one finished screenplay every six months. Now my friends, what have we learned from this exercise?
Simply put, we’ve learned that ole Sandy has written 13 first drafts. Because that’s about all you’re gonna get in six months, more or less, is a fairly descent first draft; something that, in other words, only you and your writing pals and maybe your house cat oughtta be reading. Sounds to me like Sandy would have been better off writing (and, er, um, re-writing) one or perhaps two screenplays during her 5/8/whatever years, because it’s painfully obvious that she hasn’t even learned the FIRST RULE OF SCREENWRITING yet: It’s all in the re-write. Writers who peddle a dozen scripts and bemoan their inability to “make it” have obviously confused quantity with quality. No offense, Sandy, but try writing one script exceptionally well - then see what happens. Anybody can write a script; it takes a screenwriter to make one sing.